Discussion on hosting infrastructure (Was: Starting a Free Project)


#1

Please describe your project and its purpose, hopefully in some detail. It will help the community make a decision.

I’m aware that FSMK already has many git repos on Github and am not in favour of worsening that situation. If anything, we should be working our way out of Github.


Starting a Free Project
#2

What do you suggest? Should FSMK run its own git server?


#3

Yes, FSMK should self-host its git repos. There are many free software options out there. Some common popular ones are cgit, gogs and gitlab.


#4

I think fmsk should stay on github as it stands for libre. Github provides a larger exposure to the movement.


#5

We’re not here for discussion if we should have our own servers, we all should understand that managing our own server is not too easy (take discuss going down for example). We’ve learnt that already. And Github provides few features which no other self hosted git provides. Let’s take travis for example, it works really well with Github. If you try to use something like Gitlab, we’ll have to configure that CI to run smoothly and that’s not worth it.

There are people sitting on big offices just trying to make our lives easier, I think we should take advantage of that effort. It’s not costing anyways. And maintaining a server will. I’m aware of our Freedom stuff, but some stuff aren’t just worth it. If vim can be on Github, so can our projects. We have right to choose the license anyways.


#6

I’m afraid we cannot avoid the topic when you are asking for GitHub repos from FSMK.

If you’re worried about larger exposure and server availability, just maintain a GitHub mirror for the project while keeping all the actual activity on a self hosted site. One of our servers going down is sad, but for now, it is part and parcel of the self-hosting process. We need to work on improving our server availability without buying into the notion of a “cloud” or other kinds of centralization.

Here is GNU’s ethical repository criteria.

https://www.gnu.org/software/repo-criteria-evaluation.html

GitHub scores an “F” grade on these criteria. On top of that, GitHub is a centralized service. Buying into such centralization is not good in the long run. We need decentralization and self hosting.

FSMK, a free software organization, must work towards real and complete software freedom and decentralization, not the partial half-goals that you are suggesting.


#7

I understand the value of free software, but just to put the repo on self hosted servers, I really don’t think configuring travis (not sure if it supports) or write a entirely different config for running on your self hosted server is worth anyone’s time.

When you talk about a self hosted git server, you have to see the following things really carefully.

First, we’ll have to configure somewhere, and it’s not like it’s not costing anything at all, it will. At least a few memory. Now that should be done by someone at FSMK, it’s not like you do a sudo apt-get install gitlab and it’s done.

Second, if we’re doing some kind of project which someone else should be able to use, we need to have some sort of testing integration (travis, circle ci, jenkins for example). Since we’re hosting code on our server, we’ll not want to use the their server, of course you’ll want to use it on our server.

Now to configure that is also not a child’s play, we can do it, but someone in FSMK would have to do it.

Every PR created should be tested on a container, which also consumes some memory, spinning up a VM and just using them is also not a child’s play.

Now let’s say we configure a container to do a continuous integration for golang, what if someone wants to do a project on RoR? What about Android? What about some completely different language which we don’t have images for yet?

If situations like that arise, someone would have to configure that again. Which I again say, is not worth it.

When let’s say we’re using 10 different languages, we’ll need 10 different images which will spin up every time we do a push or create a pull request, believe me, that’s a lot of memory.

It’s not easy to host our own solution for every single thing.


#8

Oh yeah. Convenience always beats freedom na?

BTW, it is actually that easy to install gitlab. We have packaged gitlab for Debian and you can see https://git.fosscommunity.in is running the packaged version.

Please read about Gitlab CI.

I agree. But that doesn’t mean we should just give up and resort to proprietary solutions. We can’t call ourselves a FOSS community, if we were to do that .


#9

With the discussion going into debating whether it should be hosted on github or not, we didn’t even find out what his project was. And if he waits for self hosted gitlab to be up before he starts his project, the project might never kick off. How about he host it on github for now and move it to self hosted solution once it’s ready? Because, there are already many projects of FSMK on github. So, why the hypocrisy and fake projection?
I feel, we decrease the productivity by being too ideal unnecessarily.

Also, the discussion about github/gitlab should move into a different thread. It’s not relevant to his project.


#10

Thank you! My point in my first comment. Never mind though, I tied up with some other folks, I really didn’t have the patience to discuss it over here. I really need travis ci (not gitlab ci) as travis has better support as this project would have tests on golang, react and android. I found someone who believes travis is good. So bye!


#11

@jee1mr I moved the thread to a new topic on infrastructure which I think is important.
@cyberhck do post about your project on the original thread. I am interested in knowing more. thanks